I endlessly admire fic authors who have betas and write chapters and chapters ahead of what they post because you best believe my needy ass is slapping just-finished, mildly edited and typo-laden fics onto AO3 the moment theyāre done so I can get that sweet sweet validation
āOrigin of faith.—Ā The fettered spirit takes up his position, not for reasons, but out of habit; he is a Christian, for example, not because he has knowledge of the various religions and has chosen between them; he is an Englishman, not because he has decided in favor of England: he encountered Christianity and Englishness and adopted them without reasons, as a man born in wine-producing country becomes a wine-drinker. Later, when he was a Christian and Englishman, he may perhaps have also devised a couple of reasons favorable to his habits; but if one refutes these reasons one does not therewith refute him in his general position.Oblige a fettered spirit to present his reasons for opposing bigamy, for example, and you will discover whether his holy zeal for monogamy rests on reasons or on acquired habit. Acquired habituation to spiritual principles without reasons is called faith.ā —Ā Human, All Too Human, Volume I, section 26 (translated by R.J. Hollingdale)
āThe intellectual conscience.— I keep having the same experience and keep resisting it every time. I do not want to believe it although it is palpable: the great majority of people lacks an intellectual conscience.Indeed, it has often seemed to me as if anyone calling for an intellectual conscience were as lonely in the most densely populated cities as if he were in a desert. Everybody looks at you with strange eyes and goes right on handling his scales, calling this good and that evil. Nobody even blushes when you intimate that their weights are underweight … I mean: the great majority of people does not consider it contemptible to believe this or that and to live accordingly, without first having given themselves an account of the final and most certain reasons pro and con, and without even troubling themselves about reasons afterward: the most gifted men and the noblest women still belong to thisĀ āgreat majority.ā But what is goodheartedness, refinement, or genius to me, when the person who has these virtues tolerates slack feelings in his faith and judgments and when he does not account the desire for certainty as his inmost craving and deepest distress—as that which separates the higher human beings from the lower.
āAmong some pious people I found a hatred of reason and was well disposed to them for that; for this at least betrayed their bad intellectual conscience. But to stand in the midst of this rerum concordia discors [discordant concord of things] and of this whole marvelous uncertainty and rich ambiguity of existence without questioning, without trembling with the craving and the rapture of such questioning, without at least hating the person who questions, perhaps even finding him faintly amusing—that is what I feel to be contemptible, and this is the feeling for which I look first in everybody. Some folly keeps persuading me that every human being has this feeling, simply because he is human. This is my type of injustice.ā — The Gay Science, section 2 (translated by Walter Kaufmann)
Hi! Thank
you for sending this interesting ask! š
I assume youāre referring to this:
No, I donāt
agree with it. This is the trope that TR was trying to maintain by retconning
all the previous canon in the franchise. Thor has never been a love martyr(except maybe once)
because:
1. Thor is
not the perfect and blameless angel who loves his completely evil brother. Thor
and Loki are both flawed characters and their relationship has been on the rocks because they both hurt each other and never actually talked about it.
2. Unlike
what Thor thinks, most of Lokiās horrible actions wasnāt about hurting Thor.
3. It didnāt
take a long time until Ragnarok for Thor to give up on Loki. Thor gave up on him
in Avengers.
Letās discuss
these points in more details:
Thor starts
his journey as an arrogant warmonger prince. He is the golden child of his
realm and Loki is his shadow. No one respects Loki or take him seriously the
way they respect Thor. Not guards, not Heimdall, not Thorsā friends and not
even servants. The way Thor treated Loki certainly had an effect on Lokiās
situation(aside from other cultural aspects). Thor doesnāt respect Loki: āEnough!ā,
āKnow your place brother!ā, āSome do battles, other do tricksā.
He doesnāt even look at Loki, when Loki speaks with him. The way Loki reacts
after these mistreatments doesnāt show his surprise, it shows that heās used to
them. Despite all of this, Loki still cares about Thor and Loves him: āYou are
my brother and my friend. Sometimes Iām envious but never doubt that I love youā.
Sabotaging
Thorās coronation was not a betrayal to Thor. Loki knew that Thor wasnāt fit to be a king yet, and
he tried to stop it. Just like Thor tried to take the throne from Hela, who was
the rightful heir, because she wasnāt suitable for the job.
I always
think the worst thing that Loki has ever done to Thor is lying to him when Thor
was in SHIELD when he was already down after failing to lift Mjolnir. Thorās āCan
I come home?ā and his tears always break my heart.
Now the
paragraph says that Loki tried to kill Thor at least twice! No, Loki almost
killed him once with the destroyer. But that was it. In their fight on the
Bifrost he only tried to stop Thor and stall him so he can destroy Jotunheim.
After that Loki never tried to kill Thor. He dropped Thor in the Hellicarrier
because he knew if Mjolnir could crack that glass, it could also break it. He
was never surprised that Thor showed up later. And donāt tell me him stabbing
Thor with that tiny dagger was an attempt on Thorās life.
Loki trying
to commit genocide on Jotunhim wasnāt about hurting Thor, it was about proving
his worthiness to Odin. Loki killed Coulson mostly because he was in his way
and he was threatening Loki with a destroyer gun. Ā But faking his death to usurp Odin? Really?
*sighs* Lokiās illusions are not solid unless itās on the person. So Loki
getting stabbed by Kursed wasnāt an illusion. He was really stabbed through
the chest to save Thor. He had no way of knowing what would happen when he attacked
Kursed. This wasnāt planned. And he couldnāt know that he would survive it. So
after he survived he didnāt tell Thor because Thor promised he would return
Loki to his cell. Usurping the throne from Odin had nothing to do with Thor.
Again it wasnāt about hurting Thor. It was about getting his revenge on Odin
for sentencing him to solitary confinement for life and all the other awful
things heād done. Then Loki as Odin offered the throne to Thor. Loki even asked him to confirm
that it was really what Thor wanted and wasnāt Janeās wish. None of the things
that the paragraph mentioned was an act of betrayal against Thor. So the line
that Thor says in TR: āI trust you, you betray me. Round and round in
circles we goā is not true.
Now letās
talk about Thor giving up on Loki and the only situation that love martyr trope can be applied to him. When he found Loki on Earth, first he asked
about Tesseract, then he said Lokiās grievances were imagined slights and then threatened
him. He once again tried to reason with Loki on the Stark Tower and was stabbed
for it. That was the last time Thor ever tried to talk to Loki. That was when
he gave up on Loki. It was obvious that Thor had forgiven Loki after everything Loki did to him in the first Thor movie and still wanted Loki to go home. He made mistakes when he was talking to Loki, but imo forgiving Loki after the way he lied to him and almost killed him was a big deal and that makes Thor a love martyr. But then Thor gives up on Loki after he is stabbed. And thatās the end of him being in the love martyr trope. He never visited Loki when Loki was imprisoned. Not even to
tell him that their mother was dead. Even when he went to Loki for help, Thor
treated Loki like a stolen relic(ālocked away here until you may have use of
meā): āI did not come here to share our griefā āI grant it to
you, vengeance, and after this cellā.
Thor and
Loki both loved and cared about each other despite the fact that the other one
hurt them. But Thor is not a love martyr. He never tried to talk to Loki and
understand him about his just grievances. He never asked Loki what happened to
him after he let go. He also made mistakes. He is not blameless in all of this.
And I just talked about the Thor we saw in every movie except TR. Because TR
Thor is very ooc and he constantly dismisses Loki and his pain. In other movies Thor simply doesnāt understand Loki. In TR he just doesnāt care to understand despite Loki trying to explain to him and trying to find a common ground with Thor. What Thor does in TR is a disgusting reverse psychology method, not giving up on Loki. Because āyouāre lateā implies that Thor knew Loki would come. So imo that paragraph in TV tropes page got it all wrong.
Thorās last words to Loki vs. Lokiās last words to Thor
Even tho Loki does care about Thor even if he has an hard time admitting it, heās still the worst brother tbh. He betrayed Thor like an hundred times over, and Thanos attacking the ship and killing half of the asgardians is entirely his fault. Thor saying this was means to be a funny scene but if we want to read more into it, he was refferring to the fact that Loki stole the tesseract while they were in the middle of a huge battle and put a huge target on the asgardian ship. In the end, Loki choose the right side but it doesnāt mean everything he did before is forgotten and if he had came out of it alive,Thor would have totally punched him in the face and then he would have hugged him
Sighā¦There are so many wrong things in your statement, Iām gonna put a little bit of my thought.
ā
He betrayed Thor like an hundred times overā
Loki didnāt betray ThorĀ āa hundred times overā , he is pretty loyal to Thor for a century, accompany Thor when Thor is still he is an arrogant war-monger.Ā
ā
Even tho Loki does care about Thor even if he has an hard time admitting it, heās still the worst brother tbh.ā
Are you gonna put aside all wrong doings Thor does to Loki like this one :
And then just straight out labeling Loki asĀ āthe worst brotherā?Ā
Yeah Thor used to be a prick but he grew out of it and being arrogant is nothing compared to what Loki has done. I love Loki, I really do but from Thorās point of view, heās been betrayed multiple times by him. Youāre using a gif of one of his worst betreyal, pushing Thor on this stupid mission knowing it would end badly and could lead to a war so Thor wouldnāt be king. Sure, itās a good thing Thor didnāt became king then bc he was immature but Loki just wanted the throne for himself, he didnāt care for the well being of Asgard. And then he goes to earth and tell Thor his father is dead, how fucked up is that? And then he try to kill Thor when heās mortal. Still, after all that, Thor try to save Loki from falling and is heartbroken over his death.
Then New York happen, Loki has been tortured yeah but he doesnāt mind killing hundred of people that he knows his brother is protecting, he actually enjoy that and he stab Thor at the end.
Loki help Thor in the dark world but for his own revenge over his motherās death and then, he still pretend to be dead so he can have the throne for himself, not caring as his brother, once again, cry over his death. The only good thing he does is saving Jane.
Thor ragnarok show us more of their wonderful relationship as children, funny but a little fucked up on lokiās part. Thor learn that Loki left Odin on earth which led to his death away from his people and the liberation of Hela. He doesnāt do anything to keep Thor from becoming a slave for the great master and try to betray him again when they leave but Thor is used to it by then and his plan doesnāt work. Okay, at the end, he makes the right call bc sometimes, he can be good and help save the asgardians but he canāt help taking the tesseract with him despite everything happening at the moment.
And it all lead it to infinity war which I already explained. But yeah, youāre right, Thor used to be a little arrogant before and sometimes though he was above his brother, which he technically was at this moment as he was heir to the throne and Loki was under his orders. But like I said, Thor grew out of his arrogant phase, thanks to lokiās āhelpā but Loki has always considered himself superior to Thor and Iām not sure he ever stopped, no matter how much he actually love his brother.
So yeah, Loki is the worst brother and anyone would have given up on him a long time ago but Thor is just that good.
ā
Yeah Thor used to be a prick but he grew out of it and being arrogant is nothing compared to what Loki has doneā
Thor has killed over 3000 people, while being a war-monger he is, he is no better than Loki himself. Itās just the way Thor killing those people is so fit with the Asgardian culture, not with a tricks or magic. Donāt try to justify Thor actions in the past withĀ āhe used to be a prickā.Ā
ā
pushing Thor on this stupid mission knowing it would end badly and could lead to a war so Thor wouldnāt be king
ā
If you look more detail, Loki mission is to showing Thor arrogant and reckless side in front of Odin to prevent Thor from getting the throne because Thor at that time wasnāt fit. Too reckless, his arrogant side will cause many conflicts. What Loki doing to Thor in Thor (2011) is just like what Thor doing to Hela in Thor Ragnarok, they both prevented their sibling from getting the throne because in their eyes, their sibling is not fit enough.Ā
ā Youāre using a gif of one of his worst betreyalā
The scene where Thor told Loki to āKnow his placeā is Thor response to Loki advice to not attack those Frost Giant. Loki kindly asked ThorĀ āThor, please stop. Look around you, we are outnumberedā, and you know what Thor responseĀ āKnow your place brotherā, he straight out dismiss Loki, treating as Loki opinion didnāt matter, and the sad things is Loki didnāt even reply back, as if Thor dismiss him is just their usual habit. This scene actually implying to Thor and Loki dysfunctional relationship for 1000 years with Thor treating Loki as the inferior, along with Warrior Three and Sif.Ā
ā
he actually enjoy that and he stab Thor at the end.ā
No, he didnāt. Right after Loki stabbed Thor, there is a tears in his eyes. He is not enjoying to stab Thor.
ā
he still pretend to be dead so he can have the throne for himselfā
Loki never pretended to be dead, he is actually getting badly injured saving Thor from Kurse, Kevin Feige and Tom Hiddleston already confirmed that in the interview. Itās just that the fate decided that Loki still survives, and then he decided to get revenge on Odin by taking the throne , it has nothing to do with Thor.Ā
ā
not caring as his brother, once again, cry over his death
ā
The reason why Loki didnāt tell Thor why he is still alive because Thor promised him to return Loki back to the cell.Ā āAnd afterward, this cellā- Thor promised Loki he would return Loki to his cell after using Loki help. Thor cries for Loki when he dies in the dark world but did Thor ever bother to bring and bury Loki body properly? No right? Shouldnāt Thor at least bring his body back to Asgard?Ā
ā
Thor ragnarok show us more of their wonderful relationship as children, funny but a little fucked up on lokiās part.
ā
The original canon of Thor and Loki childhood (confirmed by Kevin Feige and Kenneth Branaghā is Loki is the looked down kid, he looked up to Thor, he respected Thor, while Thor is the golden child, and he treated his brother with a superior big brother mindset. However, Chris Hemsworth and Taika Watiti want to change Loki and Thor childhood, with Thor being the bullied kid and Loki is the bully. However thatās not the case since in Thor 1, we viewer already showed Thor and Loki childhood. Loki was the quiet one, and Thor was an aggressive child,Ā āI will hunt all the monster down and slay them all !!ā. Thor in the original canon isĀ āmore fucked upā
ā
He doesnāt do anything to keep Thor from becoming a slave for the great master
ā
Did you see the scene where Loki want to grieve together for Odin death with Thor? Loki did tried to get Thor to work together to get off from that place by overthrowing the Grandmaster first. And what is Thor response to him? No response, and then Thor just straight up accusing LokiĀ āYou faked your own deathā.Ā
ā
try to betray him again when they leave but Thor is used to it by then and his plan doesnāt work
ā
Loki only try to betray Thor after Thor straight up shading him in the elevator withĀ āmaybe there is still good in youā line, and he did it to keep Thor safe from Hela if you actually noticed. Thor clearly use reverse-psychology on Loki in that elevator scene so he can use Loki help later.Ā
ā
But like I said, Thor grew out of his arrogant phase, thanks to lokiās āhelpā but Loki has always considered himself superior to Thor
ā
Loki considered himself as inferior to Thor, read all Thor novel. Thor treated him as inferior for a century and itās effect Loki psychology. Unconsciously Loki considered himself as the inferior one and the reason why he want to fight Thor in Thor 1 and Avenger is to prove himself. You watch too much Thor ragnarok.Ā
ā
So yeah, Loki is the worst brother and anyone would have given up on him a long time ago but Thor is just that good.
ā
And now you just straight up labeling Loki as the worst brother, and clearly ignoring Thor wrong doing to Loki (with an excuse like āThor is only a little bit arrogantā. I suggest you, donāt have a black and white perspective, Thor treatment to Loki is just as bad as Loki treatment to Thor. Thor treated Loki as inferior and always dismiss Loki feeling, even in Ragnarok and Infinity War. Did Thor even try to understand Loki perspective? He just straight out labeling Loki, just like you did.Ā
Thanks for the tag @rewritefate and @seiramili7 ( in this thread) ! I canāt believe what I just read! You guys covered everything. I just add a few things.
āEven tho Loki does care about Thor even if he has an hard time admitting it, heās still the worst brother tbh.ā
Loki is the one who ever verbally stated that he loves Thor, twice I might add and gotĀ āThank youā as answer! He is the one that tolerated a life time of being treated as inferior and he still loves Thor to the point that heās ready to sacrifice his life not only for Thor(twice!) but also for Thorās girlfriend(twice!) to prevent his brother from getting hurt. And he is the worst brother?!?!
āYeah Thor used to be a prick but he grew out of it and being arrogant is nothing compared to what Loki has done.ā
He was more than just an arrogant person. He was the textbook narcissistic golden child before his banishment and the resulting abuse from this kind of personality will have a toll on anyone. And besides Loki was never in his right mind when he did all those horrible things.
āYouāre using a gif of one of his worst betreyal, pushing Thor on this
stupid mission knowing it would end badly and could lead to a war so
Thor wouldnāt be king.ā
āLokiās worst betrayalā?! He did a service to their kingdom by preventing Thor from becoming the king! āPushing Thor on this stupid missionā!? Oh my God! Itās not Lokiās fault that all Thor needed was an agreement with his opinion and feeling thrilled to have a chance in showing that he can be a better king than Odin! Loki didnāt push him to do anything!
āknowing it would end badly and could lead to a war so
Thor wouldnāt be king.ā Did you miss the part when he told a guard to inform Odin so he prevent Thor from his stupid mission and getting them all killed
in the process? And the guard didnāt care enough to do it in time? Or the part that Heimdall let them go to Jotunheim despite the fact that it was forbidden. Or the part that Loki screamed that he never wanted the throne, only to be Thorās equal? And all he attempted to do was prove himself worthy to Odin?
āThen New York happen, Ā Loki has been tortured yeah but he doesnāt mind
killing hundred of people that he knows his brother is protecting, he
actually enjoy that and he stab Thor at the end.ā
He doesnāt mind killing hundred of people? He enjoy that? I think you once again miss the part when he looked with horror to the destruction in the Avengers and told Thor with regret in his voice that it was too late to stop it. And you definitely miss the part when he cried while he stabbed Thor. Does all this seems like enjoyment to you? Also did you forget the part where Thor admitted killing thousands of people? Or the part where he was killing Jotuns all the while grinning and was excited because of it?
āhe still pretend to be dead so he can have the throne for himself, not caring as his brother, once again, cry over his death.ā
Yeah, because offering the throne to Thor means he wanted it for himself. Itās not Lokiās fault that Thor declined it! Oh my God!
āThor learn that Loki left Odin on earth which led to his death away from his people and the liberation of Hela.ā
āLoki has always considered himself superior to Thor and Iām not sure he
ever stopped, no matter how much he actually love his brother.ā
How can someone miss all the signs!? It was always Thor who saw himself superior. It was always Loki who saw himself as inferior to Thor and wanted to prove himself equal. Itās the core of his problems!!!
Thanks for the tag @rewritefate and @seiramili7Ā š You guys and @lucianalight have already said a lot of what I want to say. Iāll just add some of my reactions to this.
Firstly: SIGH.Ā
āHe betrayed Thor like a hundred times overā<- See, this is what happens when you get brainwashed by Gagnarok. You think
that because you believe the āI trust you, you betray me, round and
round in circles we goā nonsense that Gagnarok!Thor said, thatās it.
āThanos attacking the ship and killing half of the asgardians is
entirely his faultā<-So itās Lokiās fault, not Thanosā?Ā
āThor saying this was
means to be a funny sceneā<- Youāre right about this. When I went to
watch IW I was feeling so disappointed when Thor said to Loki āyou really are
the worst brotherā, but most of the other audience seemed to find it funny. So
yes, it was meant to be funny and also a clear reference to what Thor said to
Loki before: āmaybe youāre not so bad after allā, which happens to be the only positive
affirmation Thor gave Loki in Gagnarok and is now negated just because he was
trying to be funny.
(Noteworthy fact: Thor was originally supposed to be a more serious
character in IW. But CH voiced concerns after Gagnarok portrayed the
characterās funnier side, apparently because he was ājust so protective of what he built
with Taikaā (his own words). That was why the IW writers Christopher Markus and
Stephen McFeely turned to TW for input, then rewrote Thorās character and his
storyline. With this I think we can all make an educated guess as to how
that āworst brotherā line came about.)
āLoki just wanted the
throne for himself, he didnāt care for the well being of Asgard.ā <- First
of all I strongly suggest you watch the first Thor film again. Anyway, here are
a few quotes from Loki:
āThat was just a bit
of fun, really. To ruin my brotherās big day, and to protect the realm from his idiotic rule for a while longer.ā
āI love Thor more
dearly than any of you, but you know what he is. Heās arrogant, heās reckless,
heās dangerous! You saw how he was today. Is that what Asgard needs from its
King?ā
āI never wanted the
throne, I only ever wanted to be your equal!ā
āThen New York happen,
Loki has been tortured yeah but he doesnāt mind killing hundred of people that
he knows his brother is protecting, he actually enjoy that and he stab Thor at
the end.ā<- I think you should rewatch the first Avengers film
too. Anyway hereās a screencap for your reference:
āLoki help Thor in the
dark world but for his own revenge over his motherās death and then, he still
pretend to be dead so he can have the throne for himself, not caring as his
brother, once again, cry over his death. The only good thing he does is saving
Jane.ā <- Some more quotes:
Tom:Lokiās death on Svartalfheim was written as
a death, and Chris and I played that scene for real. That was meant to be sort
of that he redeemed himself. He helped save his brother and helped save Jane
Foster, but he, in the process, sacrificed himself.
Feige: He is able to spin events, without ever
really lying to his brother, without ever actually betraying his brother, into
what is always wanted, which is sitting on the throne and saving his brother. That
last scene needed to work for people watching the movie for the first time, who
believed that itās Odin talking to Thor, and then the surprise, but it also
needs to work a second and third time. Why is Odin saying those things? Why is
Loki saying those things to Thor? Theyāre very nice things, theyāre very caring
things that he says to him. Is it partly because he loves his brother? I like
to think so. Is it also because thatās what his brother needsā¦ to leave?
Perhaps.
Thor to Loki (Thor: Ragnarok novel): āIn the past I demanded the throne when I hadnāt earned it, and then
refused the throne when Asgard needed me most.ā
āThor ragnarok show us
more of their wonderful relationship as children, funny but a little fucked up
on lokiās part.ā<- I have ranted so much about Gagnarok by now it makes
me want to gag. In short Loki was ridiculously OOC and Thor wasnāt even Thor in
that film.
āSo yeah, Loki is the
worst brother and anyone would have given up on him a long time ago but Thor is
just that good.ā<- You know how Thor said something like āIām only alive
because Fate wants me aliveā? I disagree.
Heās only alive because his āworst brotherā gave up the
Tesseract to save his thick head from getting crushed by Thanos and thatās a fact.
I donāt endorse theĀ āGagnarokā label – itās entirely too easy for people to make fun of it and dismiss serious criticisms on account of a punny insulting nickname – but everything @rewritefate, @lucianalight, and @yume-no-fantasy say in the way of analysis of character and events is exactly right. Kudos to you guys for patiently going through yet another interpretation-challenged personās regurgitated Ragnarok-dictated talking points.
And hereās this person, like so many other supposed Loki fans, sayingĀ āI love Loki, I really do, butā and then detailing how heās a completely morally bankrupt, power-hungry, sadistic narcissist with no good reasons for doing anything he did. What, exactly, do they love? You can definitelyĀ āloveā villains who have no redeeming personal qualities – in a way, I kind ofĀ āloveā General Hux because heās hilarious, and I definitely love his bizarre perpetual pissing contest of a relationship with Kylo Ren (yes, Kylux is my crack ship) – but not in anything like the way I love Loki. Loki was built from the first Thor movie as a character with depth, with complicated not-entirely-selfish motives, with severe distortions in his worldview but always with reasons you can comprehend and, on some level, sympathize with even when you strongly condemn his actions.
The fact that people are spouting claims about Lokiās motivations in previous film that contradict what you see onscreen but jibe with the claims about Loki that Ragnarok shoves down our throats indicates that it was entirely too successful in writing over the history of these characters and flattening everything into a simple black and white Thor=good and Loki=bad equation. And people are all too ready to accept that. Iād like to think itās only the people who sawĀ Ragnarok first and only later watched the other movies through its distorted lens, but I suspect some of the people gleefully latching onto this interpretation also claimed to have been fans of the previous movies even before Ragnarok came out. And the fact that theyāre saying āLoki has always considered himself superior to Thor and Iām not sure he ever stoppedā indicates that even the scene that never made it into Ragnarok, with Loki as an emo-goth Draco Malfoy-esque bully and Thor as the chubby bullied kid, has taken precedence in the minds of much of the fandom over things that actually were in canon, such as Thor reminding Loki ofĀ āhis placeā and Lokiās angry, impassioned confession – obviously not a calculated lie, if you just fucking watch the movie –Ā āI only ever wanted to be your equal.ā
It shouldnāt matter that casual MCU fans now worship at the shrine of Ragnarok and piss all over the previous characterizations of the main characters. But most of the people who consider themselves part of the Thor, Loki, Thor-and-Loki, and Thorki fandoms think this way, too. It makes me so sad and angry. Most of the people who claim to love the same characters I do really donāt; they love (or āloveā) very different characters and then tell me Iām wrong for respecting the versions that were established first. I wish it were possible to build a wall between the people who still love Thor and Loki and the people who have allowed Thor* and Loki* (their Ragnarok versions) to be painted over them. They really should be two separate fandoms.
throwback to the time my classics professor asked ādoes anyone know who sappho is?ā and i immediately replied āsheās the OG lesbianā and my professor yelled āEXACTLYā and wrote the OG lesbian on the whiteboard
shoutout to 10th century norway for having the only medieval penal code (gulaĆ¾inglƶg) iāve read that not only doesnāt suggest you torture people but explicitly says tortured confessions are made out of fear and you should specifically not listen to them. good job 10th century norway
also shoutout to tumblr mobile for letting me blog exclusively in hot pink
Loki is the Philosopher King 