Oh wait, are those Thor’s harem pants in the second gif? I couldn’t tell who that was. And is he stepping over dead Asgardians…? Escaping from Hela only to run into Thanos is a real ‘out of the frying pan, into the fire’ kind of situation…
I honestly have never been so excited for something in my whole life // Will Loki side with Thanos? Who has died in Tony’s arms? What will happen between Wanda and vision?
1. I very much doubt it; I think he’s acting under duress. 2. It’s possible that no one died; someone could just be gravely injured. (Steve??? my little shipper’s heart goes pit-a-pat.) 3. I don’t know, but it looks like sexytimes to me.
A couple more questions to add to the mix: 4. Why isn’t Vision purple in that one scene with Wanda? Is that some kind of dream sequence where he’s fantasizing about being a real boy? 5. OH NO THANOS IS TAKING THE MIND STONE OUT OF VISION’S HEAD IS HE GOING TO DIE?!?!
Well since I have almost nothing but a shitty cam rip of the IW trailer from comic con and a few bts pictures from filming to base my thoughts on, I’m probably wrong on a lot of this, but what the hell.
(spoilers for Ragnarok and IW trailer below)
Okay, so at the end of Ragnarok we see them all nice and safe on the ship and decide to go to earth, but the mid credits scene seems to completely destroy the idea that that will happen. From the IW trailer, we see Peter Quill and the Guardians run Thor over with the Milano as he’s just floating in space. This can only mean one of two things: Loki thought it would be a lark to airlock the new King of Asgard or really bad shit went down. My guess on this would be the latter, unfortunately.
So this poses a lot of questions, such as what happened to the rest of the people on the ship or is it just Thor that is having a jaunt out in space. Loki has the Tesseract, there’s no way that he did not take that before resurrecting Surtur to defeat Hela. Plus we see him in the IW trailer with it (assuming this isn’t a flashback scene).
Thanos is out for blood because he’s just that kinda guy and also Loki kinda wiggled out of his influence (he’s a slippery bugger he is).
I’ve seen a lot of people say that they’re worried about Loki turning ‘evil’ and his character development taking a few steps back from Ragnarok. Loki in Ragnarok was a dream come true for me because it full embodied Loki and who he really is. When Thor said he would be perfect to rule Sakaar because it’s a ‘savage, chaotic, lawless’ place I nearly died of happiness because really that is some of the core qualities to Loki’s. Loki is neither wholly good or evil, he’s Loki and he’s in it for himself and to cause chaos. He likes sticking his fingers into each piece of the pie and watch the players play out the game. So while yes, I am worried that they could revert Loki back to what he was in earlier movies, I don’t think he will go back to what he was. I think that he’s ultimately going to be out for pure survival because of Thanos and what’s happening. I will not be surprised if he betrays Thor, the Avengers, and Thanos all in one because that’s just how he rolls.
Now there’s the question of Loki having the Tesseract and who he is giving it to in the trailer. A lot of people think it may be Thanos or maybe one of the Black Order. I fully believe that he was under the influence in Avengers of Thanos and probably the Mind Stone. I don’t buy in that he was fully controlled by it like some do, but he was definitely affected by all that. He was a pawn in Thanos’s means to an end. So with that in mind, I think there’s a good chance he’ll defect back to Thanos claiming he was playing the long game to get the Tesseract back for him and honestly I couldn’t blame him. The state of Loki from the end credits of Thor 1 of him looking like a meth addict and then him in Avengers coming through the portal definitely indicates that something bad happened to him.
So once again Loki is the wildcard and really can go either way. I think Thanos would have to use some very big leverage or just all out mind control him to have him 100% on his side. But of course, that is all contingent if Thanos just doesn’t want to outright torture and kill him.
Another thing would be Thor and Loki planning things together and have Loki act as a spy or seem like he’s on the other side so he can get info and pass it back to Thor. It wouldn’t be the first time something like that has happened.
With Thor, I think that it’s more straightforward. Things obviously aren’t good for him and if the ship is destroyed and his people killed (except Valkyrie, Loki, and Hulk since we already know they’re in IW) then he will ultimately feel a shit ton of guilt and want to shut Thanos down as fast as possible. Again him just floating amongst the debris (of what we don’t know) where the Guardians find him in space is a bad sign. The Guardians know about the Infinity Stones and Thanos, whereas Thor only knew about the stones and an unseen threat. Now that he’s with the GotG he has more answers and I think pairing him with the Guardians is the right move since they’re more rightly aligned in the Marvel-verse in terms of their settings and storylines.
Guardians have the info Thor needs and Thor has the team that the Guardians need to stop Thanos. That’s how I think that Thor will help bridge Avengers and Guardians. We already know that Tony Stark will be with the Guardians from the trailer + the GotG cast talking about working with RDJ.
The absence of Loki being with Thor when he’s found is also very telling that he got out of there as soon as he could when Thanos shows up or he was taken by Thanos. If that’s the case then maybe the rest of the Asgardians were taken as well and Thor needs to get them back and to do that he’d need Loki.
This is now Thor King of Asgard and so he’s got so much on his shoulders that I just want to hug him forever. His duty is to his people and the universe, so I feel like he’ll be more in the mindset to do anything to get rid of Thanos and that kinda scares me because if he dies in IW then part of my soul dies as well. lololol Same goes for Loki and Tony Stark.
So in a really, really short tl;dr version: Thor, King of Asgard Mode activated and ready to throw down, while Loki, Sneaky Fucker Extraordinaire will do anything to survive this thing.
The bad version, Loki gives Thanos the tesseract and goes villain again (please let’s not ignore several movies’ worth of character development. This would just be so irredeemably lazy)
The okay version, Loki fights with the avengers but Thanos steals the tesseract and everyone blames him for letting Thanos get his hands on another infinity stone
The good version, everyone thinks Loki is about to betray them again but instead he spits in Thanos’s face, tosses the tesseract to Valkyrie and high fives Thor on his way back to fight with the Avengers
The version I am actually willing to sell a small piece of my soul for, Loki goes undercover pretending to work for Thanos again but THE ONLY PERSON WHO KNOWS IT’S A TRICK IS THOR
Keep in mind that Tom said “Thor Ragnarok will change Loki forever.” So I’m assuming going back to bad is not an option. 🙂
This is not something we’ve seen him do before. Not that he would have had any occasion to in previous movies, but this is kind of in a different category from other things he does with magic: mostly illusions, shapeshifting, and moving things around.
This is some wild-ass, blatantly self-interested speculation, but… what if the power to draw out other people’s memories is a relatively new ability that he gained from his interaction with the Mind Stone? Scarlet Witch got her powers from experimentation with the Mind Stone, and one of the things we’ve seen her do is get into people’s heads and make them experience things based on their worst fears and most painful memories.
This at least suggests that forcing people to re-experience memories is one of the things that the Mind Stone can do, in addition to co-opting their will to make them serve the aims of the wielder. I think everyone I know has dismissed the idea that Thanos was controlling Loki the way Loki controlled Barton and Selvig; that’s probably not something you can do to a magically powerful being like Loki. BUT Scarlet Witch was able to do the fear-exploiting thing with Thor, and Loki simultaneously experienced and forced the Valkyrie to re-experience her worst memory – that is something you can do to more powerful beings.
So… this provides some circumstantial evidence in favor of the theory I explore in my fic The Abyss Gazes Also about what happened between Thanos and Loki: that Thanos exploited Loki’s own fears, resentments, and insecurities and forced him to re-experience his most traumatic memories involving his family (especially Thor and Odin) to manipulate him into invading Earth on Thanos’s behalf and fighting against his adoptive family.
I was thinking exactly along these lines and am SO EXCITED that for wherever reason we have new Loki powers to play with!
I think he always had the abilities to tap into someone’s memories, there just wasn’t any place to showcase those abilities yet or maybe he just never bothered to practice them. And I think it isn’t clear if HE could see Valkyrie’s memories, or if he simply triggered her to see them.
If he did that to distract her, why not take her down before she recovers from the flashback?
Instead, he seemed only a little less dazed than she was at the end which (added to her rage at having to remember) allows her to take him out with one punch.
His stricken facial expression, as well as his general air of disorientation, did seem to suggest that he had seen it, too.
This is not something we’ve seen him do before. Not that he would have had any occasion to in previous movies, but this is kind of in a different category from other things he does with magic: mostly illusions, shapeshifting, and moving things around.
This is some wild-ass, blatantly self-interested speculation, but… what if the power to draw out other people’s memories is a relatively new ability that he gained from his interaction with the Mind Stone? Scarlet Witch got her powers from experimentation with the Mind Stone, and one of the things we’ve seen her do is get into people’s heads and make them experience things based on their worst fears and most painful memories.
This at least suggests that forcing people to re-experience memories is one of the things that the Mind Stone can do, in addition to co-opting their will to make them serve the aims of the wielder. I think everyone I know has dismissed the idea that Thanos was controlling Loki the way Loki controlled Barton and Selvig; that’s probably not something you can do to a magically powerful being like Loki. BUT Scarlet Witch was able to do the fear-exploiting thing with Thor, and Loki simultaneously experienced and forced the Valkyrie to re-experience her worst memory – that is something you can do to more powerful beings.
So… this provides some circumstantial evidence in favor of the theory I explore in my fic The Abyss Gazes Also about what happened between Thanos and Loki: that Thanos exploited Loki’s own fears, resentments, and insecurities and forced him to re-experience his most traumatic memories involving his family (especially Thor and Odin) to manipulate him into invading Earth on Thanos’s behalf and fighting against his adoptive family.
@philosopherking1887 Honestly, my inclination as well. It’s not exactly like Loki would have been around to experience this happening so he couldn’t project something that he knew or witnessed, he had to have reached into her mind.
I further thought that Loki may have also been able to blend some of these new powers into whatever the hell he did to Odin because Odin would not have known or expected his son to come at him with these abilities.
(Sidenote, my ‘funny’ head canon is that Odin regaining his mind is what caused the actual destruction of that Shady Acres old folks home, take that or leave it :p)
Oh, interesting point about Odin. That actually suggests that the Mind Stone allows someone to delete or alter memories, or maybe even implant false ones. I was resisting the idea that that was something Thanos could have done to Loki – even though it’s a much neater explanation of the “I remember you tossing me into an abyss” line – because I thought it would be more interesting, poignant, and ultimately fucked-up if he was able to get Loki to the point he was at in “The Avengers” using only Loki’s own memories and emotions as raw material…
Oh yeah I 100% still think Loki took the tesseract. Just maybe that’s not how he escaped Surtur’s big firestorm.
Also I won’t be surprised if the reason Thanos’s ship found them is BECAUSE Loki took the tesseract and Thanos was tracking it.
We know that Loki escaped in the orgy ship because we see it perched on the big ship toward the end. I only noticed that on the second viewing because I was looking for it, though.
I’m also 100% sure Loki took the Tesseract for two reasons, one story-internal and one external. The internal reason is that Loki knew Asgard was going to blow up and that when it did the Tesseract was just going to go flying off into space somewhere, which would be an incredible waste of an Infinity Stone as far as he was concerned. The external reason is Chekhov’s gun, basically: why did they make a point of showing Loki’s attention being attracted by the Tesseract if they weren’t going to do anything with that?
Loki is the Philosopher King 