marvellingoverlife:

“ Based on this outline of Loki’s personality and history alone, it is unsurprising that the nature and purpose of his character are still unknown and debated among modern scholars. There seems to be no apparent reason for his varying personality traits, and even less of an indication of his motives. The intentions of Loki in the ancient Norse tradition are lost now, or have yet to be found, but he still remains the most intriguing figure to debate and consider from the Norse pantheon. ”

Source

I wonder what you mean with “Loki’s Jewish-coding”. Loki is a Norse god, of Scandinavian origin, not Jewish/middle-eastern. I hope I just misunderstood your fandom tropes because making him a Jew all of a sudden seems extremely weird. Scandinavians can also have VERY curly hair and straighten it because we don’t like it.

someillplanetreigns:

stmonkeys:

philosopherking1887:

Um… I’m sort of confused by the assumption that I’m an idiot that seems to be underlying this question. Pretty clearly, I hope, I was talking about Marvel’s Loki, not the original Loki of Norse myth. In fact, in the post you’re talking about, I referred to it as “[MCU] Loki’s Jewish-coding.” The reason “MCU” is in brackets is that I didn’t want to exclude the Loki of the classic Marvel comics—who, I think I recall @fuckyeahrichardiii​ telling me, is even more intensely and problematically Jewish-coded than MCU Loki. I read and write fanfiction about MCU Loki primarily; writers do draw on the myths that inspired the comics and films, but for the most part the more recent fictional representations are the basis.

Because I am not an idiot, I do know that Loki is a Norse god of Scandinavian origin, and it would be absurd to claim that the Loki of myth has Jewish or Middle Eastern characteristics. I have read, in connection with the controversy about the origin of Loki’s name, that he may be a holdover from an earlier, perhaps pre-Indo-European pantheon that was replaced by the Norse one. The Jotnar in Norse myth, like the Titans of Greek myth, do seem to play the role of “old gods” that might represent the gods of the pre-Indo-European populations that were conquered and/or displaced by Indo-European settlers just as the Jotnar/Titans are conquered and displaced by the Aesir/Olympians. Loki is unusual in being a Jotun who is accepted into the community of the Aesir – perhaps an older native god being borrowed into the invaders’ religion? So Loki is already an Other, an outsider relative to the rest of the Norse pantheon.

Despite the fact that Marvel was using Norse gods as the basis for their Asgardian characters, the comics originated in 20th-century America, which was, ineluctably, subject to a number of other cultural influences. Mainstream American culture has been primarily shaped by Christian European culture, and the Other par excellence of Christian Europe has always been the Jew. In European culture, Jewish men have been feminized and, especially around the turn of the 20th century, have been compared to or associated with gay men in light of their shared status as outsiders, as an alien and inscrutable Other, and presumed untrustworthiness. (This is brought out in an especially poignant way by Marcel Proust, a gay man and the son of a Jewish woman, in In Search of Lost Time, particularly in his treatment of the Dreyfus Affair, which was THE political event of the 1890s and left a deep scar on French society that still hadn’t healed when Proust’s books were published 20-30 years later.)

Marvel’s Loki hits many of the points associated with the figure of the Jew in European culture. He is the eternal foreigner in Asgard, his loyalties constantly in question. He is portrayed as sly and manipulative, always pulling strings from behind the scenes, forever plotting to take power from the rightful rulers of Asgard. He does tend to be queer- or feminine-coded, which on its own isn’t necessarily evidence of Jewish-coding, but reinforces the rest of the image. Aside from having dark hair while most Asgardians are blond/golden-haired—a standard trope for emphasizing the “Oriental” origins of European Jews, though many (like myself) are blond or (like my mother and grandmother) red-haired—the Loki of the classic comics also tends to have a hooked nose. (Which is pretty common among cartoon villains, especially sly and conniving ones…)

I first became aware of the implicit Jewish-coding of MCU Loki—which might have been unintentional, or just a consequence of the adaptation from the comics—when I happened across a couple of videos setting footage from Thor and The Avengers to songs from The Prince of Egypt, including “All I Ever Wanted” and “The Plagues.” I realized that Loki’s position as member of a foreign enemy group, rescued from death as a baby and raised, in ignorance of his heritage, as the second prince of the society that conquered the society of his origin, was very similar to that of Moses in The Prince of Egypt. (That movie doesn’t adhere exactly to Moses’s story in Exodus; Moses did actually know where he came from because his sister Miriam volunteered his birth mother as a wet nurse for him. But then, in some versions of the comics, Loki does know that he’s either adopted or Odin’s bastard, so that doesn’t necessarily spoil the parallel.) Then I noticed some of the other characteristics that set Loki apart from Asgardian society at large and his adoptive family in particular… I actually had Loki comment on it in my first Thorki fic, Desert Flowers, which takes place after Loki visits Berlin in the 1920s. (I doubt Antagonistic Anon will care, but some of my other followers might be interested.) It’s easiest for me just to quote that passage. Here Loki is explaining Midgardian racism, including antisemitism, to Thor:

“There are a few characteristic physical traits, though they’re not consistent. Long, arched nose; dark curly hair.” Loki stopped short, his lips pressed tightly together. “In general, they don’t look any more different from other Europeans than I do from you,” he forced himself to say good-humoredly. “In fact, I was given rather shoddy service at a few restaurants—and even turned away from one inn that I was certain still had vacancies—which was very puzzling until I realized that they thought I was Jewish… a member of this group, I mean.”

“Huh,” said Thor disgustedly […]

Loki cleared his throat. “At any rate,” he continued, “the animus toward them centers on their supposed character: greedy, ambitious, deceitful; physically weak, but clever and devious enough to gain power through indirect means.” Me again. Too interested in scholarly pursuits, not enough in manly physical activities; prone to neurosis. All too quickly, the list of antisemitic stereotypes that he had heard tossed around in Berlin had turned into a catalogue of Loki’s own inadequacies. While Thor is the very embodiment of the ‘Aryan ideal.’

Pretty obviously MCU Loki’s hair is naturally curly because Tom Hiddleston’s hair is naturally curly and they can’t always keep it under control. But in combination with its unusual color, the unusual texture and his apparently intense desire to slick it into submission spoke to me. I’ve struggled with the frizzy texture of my own hair, and a lot of other Jews I know try to tame it in various ways, while others go natural and embrace the “Jew-fro.” I’m sure Scandinavian people can have curly hair, and I’m not ruling out an interpretation of Loki’s dislike of his curly hair that has nothing at all to do with his status as Other. But for me it just fits in with everything else that I’ve mentioned.

Jeez, I kind of can’t believe I wrote that much in response to what clearly was not a friendly question. I’m honestly kind of puzzled as to why Anon was so bothered by an offhand comment about Loki being Jewish-coded. (Like, is there a problem with Jews “appropriating” Scandinavian culture…? Don’t worry, folks, Jews have absolutely no interest in replacing you.) Actually, this is the second hostile anonymous “question” I’ve received in the past two weeks, both with decently good grammar (unusual for anon hate) but premised on a wildly uncharitable, deliberately obtuse interpretation of something I wrote (my response to the first is here). If the second didn’t regard a pretty widely shared post of mine, I might suspect a single unfriendly blog-stalker. This is kind of weird, since I never used to get obnoxious anonymous comments; I guess the cost of gradually increasing exposure is assholes.

@darklittlestories, @incredifishface, I thought you might find this whole thing mildly entertaining… Oh, and @andreashwood, because you’re a “Prince of Egypt” fan.

Interesting parallels you draw here.   I can totally see Loki being a member of the tribe in the scenarios you portray

So this is an amazing post, and you can actually expand it into certain modern responses to the mythology – Marten Eskil Winge’s painting Thor’s Fight with the Giants (1872) became super popular with right-wing extremists in the 20th C, partly because Thor has a swastika on his belt but also because it shows a triumphant, gleaming blond man conquering over these dark-looking Others, the Jotnar. So it’s not even like this originated with the Marvel comics or the MCU, but rather on the back of a violent re-interpretation of the myths themselves.      

Sort of tooting my own horn by reblogging this, but that was a really interesting point about the painting, and I thought it would be informative to share it:

image

I got this image from fineartamerica.com. If you follow the link, you can zoom in on segments of the painting and see the swastikas on Thor’s belt.