Tag: loki

What do you think would be worse for Loki, death or more movies directed by TW for him (because after Ragnarok’s success Marvel will keep him on the Thor movies.)

Wait, are there even going to be more Thor movies? I thought a trilogy was all each of the major heroes get, and then they’ll be replaced by a new roster. (I kind of hope for more cameos in other heroes’ films, especially from RDJ, but I know it’s open season in Infinity War…)

Loki’s character was not completely massacred in Ragnarok (though it often seemed like TW was trying his damnedest), and it’s possible that TW could be convinced that it’s a good idea not to alienate Loki’s fans…? I don’t know, maybe if he directed another movie it wouldn’t be the worst thing for Loki. Thor’s character suffered more lasting damage, I think, and I blame CH equally. As a general point, though, I’d rather have a character I love die an emotionally satisfying death than suffer slow character assassination by indifferent or hostile writers, directors, etc. I just don’t really trust Markus & McFeely (the IW screenwriters) or the Russo brothers, either. I’d rather have Joss Whedon still writing (yeah, yeah, give it a rest, Tumblr) – though after how he killed Wash in Serenity, maybe not…

isaacsapphire:

burning-harvest:

Here’s what bothers me: the devotion to the Good Guys, and the adulation of the Good Guys, coupled with the refusal to sympathize or empathize with the Bad Guys.

It’s the thing I dislike about that one gif- the one that’s that guy going “Cool motive- still murder”.

I don’t think that anyone is obliged to emotionally care about or empathize with anyone else.

But I think that that’s not what’s happening here.

It seems like people notice that they are feeling sympathetic/empathetic towards Kylo Ren, then they specifically decide that he isn’t worthy of being sympathetic/empathetic towards because he’s a bad guy. That’s… a poor decision based on faulty ideas.

You don’t avoid evil or counter evil by Othering the bad guys. There is potential for evil within everyone, and there is too potential for good. Those who do evil things deserve to be cared for; and naturally arising feelings of care or relation or empathy shouldn’t be ignored.

Deliberately ignoring resonances with the Bad Guys prevents you from (1) exploring your own potential for darkness, managing it, determining whether it is truly evil, and drawing strength from it and (2) accurately viewing them as a full and actual person rather than as a standup strawman.

So much of it feels performative: I hate Kylo Ren and think he doesn’t “deserve” to be empathized with and therefore I’m a good person! I don’t feel connected to him in any way and would never make that kind of mistake!

That’s great. Really great. I’m glad that you’re perfect.

I’ve seen this before.

There’s a much bigger danger here then missing out on some fun media experience: not understanding how people do bad things, and worse, considering yourself someone who categorically cannot do bad things, is a set-up for doing bad things yourself.

Fiction, with the possibility of exploring characters who are labeled as “the bad guy” who still have understandable motives, are sympathetic, maybe even have Tragic Backstories of their own, helps us learn how to avoid repeating these mistakes, how to tell good ideas from ideas that in retrospect, will be “it seemed like a good idea at the time” ideas.

And yes, performance and purity are absolutely part of this.

led-lite:

philosopherking1887:

foundlingmother:

philosopherking1887:

foundlingmother:

philosopherking1887:

toomanylokifeels:

I wonder if Loki thought about when he was falling through the abyss when Strange left him falling for thirty minutes

HOLY SHIT ME TOO

I was definitely bothered that they were being so cavalier about something that’s plausibly a PTSD trigger for him. But I guess he’s over it now, right? Because he was telling that clearly *hilarious* story to his new friends on Sakaar that ended with “and then I let go.”

HOLY SHIT?!

I did not even catch what story he was telling on Sakaar? He was telling them about his suicide attempt? What the fuck?!

From the shooting script (available here, among other places): “There was a wormhole in space and time beneath me. At that moment, I let go.”

New headcanon: Loki is telling the people of Sakaar about something that isn’t his fucking suicide attempt. Let’s say he’s telling them about some adventure he, Thor, Sif, and the Warriors Three had where Loki had to save everyone (perhaps he’s exaggerating, perhaps not). Yeah, that sounds good to me.

The best I can make of it is what you and some others have done with the horrible play: call it a really weird coping strategy.

I thought prettying up his story of how he wandered onto literal trash dump planet was a maneuver to charm the locals tbh

Ah, so you thought he was telling it so that the suicide attempt was how he ended up on Sakaar, rather than getting pushed out of the Bifrost? Yeah, I can see how that might be more dramatic and compelling. Still not sure why everyone laughs. Maybe he told it as his escape from a horrible situation, expecting to survive rather than trying to die.

foundlingmother:

philosopherking1887:

foundlingmother:

philosopherking1887:

toomanylokifeels:

I wonder if Loki thought about when he was falling through the abyss when Strange left him falling for thirty minutes

HOLY SHIT ME TOO

I was definitely bothered that they were being so cavalier about something that’s plausibly a PTSD trigger for him. But I guess he’s over it now, right? Because he was telling that clearly *hilarious* story to his new friends on Sakaar that ended with “and then I let go.”

HOLY SHIT?!

I did not even catch what story he was telling on Sakaar? He was telling them about his suicide attempt? What the fuck?!

From the shooting script (available here, among other places): “There was a wormhole in space and time beneath me. At that moment, I let go.”

New headcanon: Loki is telling the people of Sakaar about something that isn’t his fucking suicide attempt. Let’s say he’s telling them about some adventure he, Thor, Sif, and the Warriors Three had where Loki had to save everyone (perhaps he’s exaggerating, perhaps not). Yeah, that sounds good to me.

The best I can make of it is what you and some others have done with the horrible play: call it a really weird coping strategy.

foundlingmother:

philosopherking1887:

toomanylokifeels:

I wonder if Loki thought about when he was falling through the abyss when Strange left him falling for thirty minutes

HOLY SHIT ME TOO

I was definitely bothered that they were being so cavalier about something that’s plausibly a PTSD trigger for him. But I guess he’s over it now, right? Because he was telling that clearly *hilarious* story to his new friends on Sakaar that ended with “and then I let go.”

HOLY SHIT?!

I did not even catch what story he was telling on Sakaar? He was telling them about his suicide attempt? What the fuck?!

From the shooting script (available here, among other places): “There was a wormhole in space and time beneath me. At that moment, I let go.”

toomanylokifeels:

I wonder if Loki thought about when he was falling through the abyss when Strange left him falling for thirty minutes

HOLY SHIT ME TOO

I was definitely bothered that they were being so cavalier about something that’s plausibly a PTSD trigger for him. But I guess he’s over it now, right? Because he was telling that clearly *hilarious* story to his new friends on Sakaar that ended with “and then I let go.”

swwswwsww:

luxury-loki:

Scene from ‘Thor: Ragnarok’ (2017) // This is such an important moment for Loki. A LOT of Ragnarok posts coming up over the week people.

I have such a love/hate relationship with the trope of a father figure announcing a blanket “I love you” to a formerly estranged child. Because really? It brings nothing, solves nothing and helps nothing after decades of conflict that the parental figure was mostly directly responsible for. And yet I know I’m supposed to have warm feelings about it because I’m being fed the standard shortcut trope to insta-family love and it’s an improvement over “your birthright was to die” -which was the last conversation Odin had with Loki prior to this gifset.

I rewatched Thor last night. I hadn’t seen it in a while. I didn’t really like it before. I thought the larger than life good guys were a bit sloppily depicted, but I enjoyed it much better this time after having read your musings on Loki’s psychology during the drama. I can appreciate it now. And when Loki falls into space, we can say goodbye to that characterization. I like Joss’ flamboyant sexy bad guy characterization, but it distort the character away from his Shakespearean complexity.

Well, as many of my readers/blog followers know, I think there are ways to square the tragic Shakespearean anti-villain in Thor with the (apparently) flamboyant sexy bad guy in The Avengers, and my longest ongoing work of fanfiction is an effort to do just that. Loki’s time in the Void definitely changed him; it hardened him in certain ways, but clearly he has also fallen under Thanos’s power in some way or other and remains vulnerable. His loyalty to his family and Asgard (though not Odin) was also recoverable, apparently, so whatever happened didn’t completely turn him evil.

Whedon was deliberately leaving open a possibility for redemption by showing Loki as under threat from Thanos, and not just violent and power-mad but fearful. He also showed that Loki was conflicted, and genuinely tempted by Thor’s offers of affection and salvation. Ultimately, I think Whedon came closer than anyone else to approximating the classical tone of the first Thor, though The Avengers was more epic than tragedy.